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全球化在病毒肆虐下瓦解了 【中英對照翻譯】

作者:Urs Gehriger 采訪 Steve Bannon 26/03/2020

翻譯 / 引言:TCC

引言:

這篇文章是美國川普總統的前首席戰略家史蒂夫·班農(Steve Bannon)接受訪問的訪問稿。這篇以「全球化項目結束了」為主題的訪問,可以看出班農先生對民族主義的瞭解,全球化對歐洲造成的傷害,以及對中國共產黨的痛斥。

班農揭示了由於疫情肆虐全球,中共想利用歐盟及一帶一路統治歐洲,以及想利用控制在中共國重要的國家安全、健康等生產鏈來統治美國,進而抨擊了達沃斯‘黨’主張的全球化政策的錯誤。他指出國家是給予公民最好的保護、最多的權利和最多的義務的基本管理單位, 而不只在發展經濟。

他並強調這次新冠病毒疫情肆虐全球,罪魁禍首是中國共產黨,而不是世界上最勤勞、最誠信的人之一的中國人。中國共產黨必須對這件事負起責任,應該中共每位高管和個人的所有財務、所有銀行帳戶都應被凍結。中共是人類禍害的根源,這樣做才能真正切斷中共的生命線,釜底抽薪,使他們永遠無法再危害世人。

Steve Bannon:“The globalization project is over”

Steve Bannon is considered the prophet of anti-globalization. He encouraged US President Trump to follow the path of "economic nationalism" and to confront China. With Wuhan at the epicenter of a disastrous pandemic Bannon pledges to “dedicate my life” to make sure the Chinese leadership is “held accountable” for the damage done.

史蒂夫·班農: “全球化項目結束了”

史蒂夫·班農被認為是反全球化的先知。他鼓勵美國總統川普走“經濟民族主義”的道路,與中共國對抗。武漢處於災難性大流行的中心,班農承諾“奉獻我的生命”,以確保中國領導人對造成的損失“負責”。

As chief strategist to the US President, Steve Bannon encouraged Donald Trump to take on China. After the outbreak of the corona pandemic in Wuhan, he steps up his criticism of the Chinese Communist Party. Bannon is convinced that even if the worst is over in a few months, “there will be 10 to 20 years of carnage”. After we get through this, “China should be immediately cut off by the world.”

作為美國總統的首席戰略家,史蒂夫·班農(Steve Bannon)鼓勵川普(Donald Trump)接管中共國。武漢發生冠創病毒大流行後,他加大了對中國共產黨的批評。 Bannon堅信,即使疫情最壞的情況在幾個月內結束,“也將會持續10至20年的大屠殺”。解決了這一問題之後,“世界應該立即與中共國隔絕。”

For a long time,you have been an outspoken critic of the so-called “Davos Man” and the globalization of economy and politics. Steve Bannon,do you see in the current crisis the collapse of the world order that you have long been condemning?

長期以來,您一直對所謂的“達沃斯人”以及經濟和政治全球化直言不諱。史蒂夫·班農(Steve Bannon),您是否看到當前危機中您長期以來一直譴責的世界秩序的崩潰?

The order of the Chinese Communist Party is now under assault. The CCP has basically co-opted the international rules-based order for their own use; through ‘One Belt One Road’,through ‘Made in China 2025’ (a strategic plan to produce higher-value products and services),through Huawei. Those three converge and make them the dominant economic hegemony of the 21st century.

中國共產黨的秩序正在受到攻擊。中共基本上選擇了國際規則的秩序供自己使用;由“一帶一路”,“中國製造2025”(生產更高價值產品和服務的戰略計劃),到華為。這三者合而為一,成為21世紀的主要經濟霸權。

Is this hegemony now challenged because of the corona pandemic?

現在是否因為新冠病毒大流行而挑戰了這霸權主義?

The CCP has suppressed the information about the Coronavirus until mid January. So,we lost two months since the outbreak that could have stopped this. A study from the Southampton University shows that 95% of the economic and financial capital markets destruction,and also a large part of the death rate, could have been stopped,if the Chinese Communist Party had put severe measures in place three weeks earlier. So the CCP is 100% responsible that they allowed this to happen.

中共一直壓制有關冠狀病毒的信息,直到一月中旬。因此,自爆發以來我們損失了兩個月,這本是可以阻止的情況。南安普敦大學的一項研究表明,如果中國共產黨提前三週採取了嚴厲措施,那麼本來可以遏止95%的經濟和金融資本市場破壞以及很大一部分的死亡率。因此,中共必須對他們允許這種情況發生承擔100%的責任。

They are no different than Hitler and Gaddafi. They're just a group of gangsters. They are refusing to share any of the real information with the world,including the World Health Organization from Geneva.

他們和希特勒和卡扎菲一樣。他們只是一群黑幫。他們拒絕與世界分享任何真實信息,包括來自日內瓦的世界衛生組織。

First China kept the real impact of the coronavirus secret. It claimed it wasn't spreading among humans,and then it cracked down on medical warnings. Chinese authorities waited for a month after the first case to notify the World Health Organization. Did they steal precious time for the West to understand what's going on and to take precautions and react?

首先,中共國為冠狀病毒的真正影響力保密了。中共聲稱病毒不會人與人類傳播,然後打擊了醫療警告。在第一例病例之後,中共當局等待了一個月才通知世界衛生組織。他們是否偷走了西方用來了解發生的事情並採取預防措施做出反應的寶貴時間?

I would calculate it as two months. I think when the story truly comes out,it’s going to realize it was mid-November. They didn’t really get the World Health Organization involved until about mid-January.

依我計算大約是兩個月。我認為當這個故事真相揭露時,將會意識到這是十一月中旬開始的。直到1月中旬,他們才讓世界衛生組織插手。

Wuhan is 40% larger than New York City. It has 14 million people. They literally quarantined an entire city that size and went door to door to ascertain who had the infection. They did things on the quarantines and the shutdown that the West is just physically incapable of doing. We don't really have the ability in London, Paris,Berlin,Rome,or New York City or Washington DC to literally go door to door. We just don't have resources,even if we called in the army,it's almost impossible for us to do that. They had the ability because they have totalitarian control. That's what made this huge event.

武漢比紐約大40%。它有1400萬人。他們實際上隔離了一個那麽大的城市,並挨家挨戶查明誰感染了。他們在隔離和關閉方面所用的一些方法,而西方在實質上是無法做到的。在倫敦,巴黎,柏林,羅馬,紐約或華盛頓特區,我們真的沒有能力挨家挨戶的。我們沒有資源,即使我們招募了軍隊,我們也幾乎不可能做到的。他們之所以有能力,是因為他們是極權主義的控制。這就是能造成大事件的原因。

In those 60 days where they suppressed the information,the virus got out of control. We don't move today,I know from at least some of our sources in China that there's many far more sick and there're many,many more deaths than they essentially reported.

在他們抑制信息的60天內,病毒失控了。今天我們不採取行動,至少從中共國來的一些消息來源知道,患病的人數與死亡人數要比實際報導的要多得多。

Since the corona crisis hit Europe,each country started to look out for itself. The nation states are back in charge. What is the future of the EU?

自從歐洲遭受冠狀病毒危機以來,每個國家都開始自我防衛。民族國家重新掌權。歐盟的未來是什麼?

What we're seeing in Europe is the collapse of the European Union. Why? Because the European Union and everything that stands for open borders not really helping these countries out,is coming to highlight this crisis. Europe literally is on fire with this virus. I believe that Italy as a country is going to collapse. What I mean by that,I believe the banking system is going to collapse. I think the medical system is going to collapse. I think with it,the government is going to collapse. I think they're going to have major cultural social problems.

我們在歐洲所看到的是歐盟的崩潰。為什麼?因為歐盟以及代表開放邊界的一切都不能真正幫助這些國家擺脫困境,反而凸顯出這場危機。歐洲實際上正遭受這病毒所帶來的災難。我相信意大利整個國家將會崩潰。我的意思是,我相信其銀行系統將崩潰、醫療系統將崩潰,因此我認為其政府將會崩潰。我認為他們將面臨重大的文化及社會問題。

What was the biggest mistake,failure to close the borders?

最大的錯誤是什麼,無法關閉邊界嗎?

We've seen that the failure to lock down their borders,the failure to have borders; it hurt France,it hurt Spain,it hurt Germany,everywhere across the board. The EU not being there to help countries get on top of this when countries reach out for support,shows you that the EU will not exist after this crisis like it existed beforehand. Because I think every nation,even the ones that were huge European Union supporters,realized that the policies are wrong in that people didn't come to their aid when they needed them. I got to tell you,my heart goes out to the European people,to the Italian people. At the end of this pandemic,even if it comes about shortly in the next three,four or five months,there's 10 to 20 years of carnage that we're going to have to work ourselves through. Economic carnage,financial carnage,and the health system carnage and personal carnage. So this is going to leave a deep scar on the world.

我們已經看到,未能封鎖邊界,以及無法控制邊界;這傷害了法國,傷害了西班牙,傷害了德國,無處不在。當這些國家需要幫助時,歐盟不會在那裡幫助各國解決這一問題,這顯示,在這場危機之後,歐盟將不再像以前那樣存在。因為我認為每個國家,甚至是那些受到歐盟大力支持的國家,都意識到政策是錯誤的,因為人們在需要時沒有提供援助。我必須告訴你,我的心向歐洲人民,意大利人民致敬。在大流行結束時,即使在接下來的三,四個或五個月內很快爆發,我們也必須經歷10至20年的大屠殺。經濟大屠殺,金融大屠殺以及衛生制度大屠殺和人類大屠殺。因此,這將給世界留下深深的傷痕。

You have been promoting economic nationalism as an antithesis of globalism. As chief strategist to the President you advised Donald Trump to follow this course. Are we seeing the dawning of a new era of economic nationalism?

您一直在提倡經濟民族主義作為全球化的對立面。作為總統的首席戰略家,您建議唐納德·川普(Donald Trump)遵循這一方向。我們是否正在看到經濟民族主義新時代的到來?

You're saying that is economic nationalism,I say it is nationalism,which I think is a healthy thing. The nation-state is the basic unit of governance to give the citizen the best protections and the most rights and also the most obligations. So that's what we’ve got to get back to. We're not talking about states that are warring with each other, we're talking about states that look after their citizens. If Italy had acted more like a nation-state,if France had acted more like a nation-state, if Spain had had acted more of a nation-state; if there had been more nationalists in their leaders,this problem would not have been as bad as it was allowed to metastasize.

您說的是經濟民族主義,我說這是民族主義,我認為這是健康的事情。民族國家是給予公民最好的保護,最多的權利和最多的義務的基本管理單位。這就是我們要做的。我們不是在談論彼此交戰的州,而是在照顧那些公民的州。如果意大利的舉止更像一個民族國家,如果法國的舉止更像一個民族國家,如果西班牙的舉止更像一個民族國家。如果他們的領導人中有更多的民族主義者,那麼這個問題就不會像被這樣允許擴散般的嚴重了。

The globalization project is over. The party of Davos has been shredded with this pandemic. They're guilty of being an accomplice to the Chinese Communist Party in having this pandemic infect mankind.

全球化這項目已經結束了。”達沃斯黨”已被這場大流行所粉碎。他們是引起這場感染人類大流行的中國共產黨的同謀。

Should we bring back manufacturing and production back to our nation-states? And if yes,what kind of production should we bring back?

我們是否應該將製造和生產帶回我們的民族國家?如果是,我們應該帶回什麼樣的產品?

It's different for each country,but I think you've definitely got to bring back what gives you the health in national security. I think countries have been too flippant to think that the country is there to provide an economy,not that the country is there to provide the fulfillment and prosperity of its citizens.

每個國家/地區都不盡相同,但是我認為你一定要把給你帶來國家安全的東西帶回來。我認為各國實在太過輕率,以為國家是在那裡提供經濟,而不是在那裡提供公民的充實和繁榮。

I can tell you right now, if the United States was to bring back our manufacturing and to bring back all of the production of these basic drugs and other medical equipment and also the supply chain from China,that's going to be huge. It's going to be a huge part of the focus,I think politically,going forward.

我現在可以告訴你,如果美國要恢復我們的製造業,並恢復所有這些基本藥物和其他醫療設備的生產以及在中國的供應鏈,那將是巨大的。在政治上,我認為這將是重點的一大部分。

What has to happen immediately after we get through this?

解決了這個問題後,會立即發生什麼?

Well,first off,China should be immediately cut off by the world.

首先,世界應該立即與中共國隔絕。

Cutting off 1,4 billion people?

切斷14億人口?

This is not about the Chinese people. The Chinese people are among the most decent,hard working people on earth. This is about the Chinese Communist Party. To me,the Chinese Communist Party has to be held accountable at the UN,all of their finances have got to be cut off by the City of London and Wall Street, and also in Switzerland. All of their bank accounts should be frozen. Every executive and person at the CCP,all of their country bank accounts should be frozen,all their personal bank accounts should be frozen. Every person must commit to bring back the entire supply chain from China.

這與中國人無關。中國人民是地球上最誠信,最努力的人之一。這是關於中國共產黨的。對我而言,中國共產黨必須對聯合國負起責任,其所有財務都必須與倫敦市和華爾街以及瑞士切斷關係。他們的所有銀行帳戶都應被凍結。中共的每位高管和個人,他們的所有國家銀行帳戶都應該被凍結,他們的所有個人銀行帳戶都應該被凍結。每個人都必須致力於從中共國帶回整個供應鏈。

What do you hope to gain from this?

您希望從中獲得什麼?

The Chinese Communist Party is not a friend of European countries. It wants to be the master of European countries. If you want freedom and economic opportunities for your people,then you've got to stand up to the Chinese Communist Party.

中國共產黨不是歐洲國家的盟友。它想成為歐洲國家的主人。如果您想為自己的人民提供自由和經濟機會,那麼您就必須站起來抵抗中國共產黨。

Steve Bannon,66,was chief strategist to President Donald Trump. In recent months he has been broadcasting the daily radio show and podcast "War Room"

現年66歲的史蒂夫·班農(Steve Bannon)是唐納德·川普總統的前首席戰略家。最近幾個月,他一直在廣播每日電台節目和播客“作戰室

編輯:【喜馬拉雅戰鷹團】